Writes ' have a new system for distributing their music. At they will be selling their soundboard concert recordings. Most 2-3 hour concerts will cost $10 to download in mp3 format, $13 to download in the lossless shn format.

What makes this interesting is that they're putting no DRM on these files at all. How are they protecting themselves? One paragraph in: 'Live Phish Downloads relies on an honor system, and we ask that you do not abuse the unrestricted nature of these files. If you would like to see this type of delivery of shows continue and flourish, please respect our taping policy and don't abuse the system.' ' The honor system has served them well in the past, what with allowing their fans to record their concerts while also selling both studio and live albums. Recording live is tough, since it introduces a large set of elements that either don't exist in or can be controlled in a studio (echoes in indoor venues, for example).

But good live recording is an art that can be mastered and many extremely well recorded live performances do exist. On top of that, many real musicians are at their best when playing live - it has a lot to do with being bona fide musicians who can introduce the element of surprise through variation, moments of inspiration and playing off audience reaction. Good live artists / recordings can convey a sense of 'electricity' in performance that is rarely captured in the studio.

A few really great performances even shine through poor recordings to the extent that one can overlook a poor recording. BTW, I thought that I was the only one here that would remember Renaissance - I had the fortune to see them live about 120 years ago along with Fairport Convention and Steeleye Span. Obviously you do not participate in (or were cognizant of the existance of) the activity of 'tape-trading'. Many of the shows I've collected sound as good, if not better than those produced and sold by 'the man'. These days its not uncommon for tapers to get direct feeds off the soundboards. Perhaps you should visit the Internet Archive, specifically the Audio section that deals with Etree / lossless recording. Over the past few months they've been actively aquiring and archiving shows (in shn and flac format) from taper friendly bands.

Phish opt'd out of the archive, probably because they were working on thier own distribution system (which we are now seeing the genisis of). Download a couple of shows (if you got the bandwidth), convert and burn to audio CD. I think you might be pleasantly suprised. And the kicker is, there is quite a broad selection of acts hosted. Six months ago I never heard of String Cheese Incident. To be picky, this shouldn't be mistaken with the same quality as 'A Live One' or 'Slip Stich & Pass'.

The true commercial live albums they've produced are made in a very different fashion. These are simply a recording of the feed coming off the board containing the same stuff that goes into the house speakers at the show. While it's not optimized for home listening, it still sounds great. True live albums are recorded differently, more like a studio album. One big difference is that they are always matrix recordings of the soundboard mixed with audience mics for ambiance.

This makes it sound brighter and more alive. Also, professional live tapes are recorded to multitrack with each track a distinct instrument. Traditionally, this is done in a van outside the venue for sound isolation purposes. So you're right in that the quality of these is better than audience tapes, they're still a notch below true live albums.

Audiophiles (most of the live taping trend in Dead, Phish, SCI, etc) are VERY serious about the quality of their recordings. I actually prefer a AUD (audience) taped show than an SBD b/c of the crowd noise. I like to hear the reaction (especially if I hadn't been there) of the people listening to the show. It's amazing to hear what the Grateful Dead or String Cheese does to people.

You hear them in their best. SBD's are PERFECT copies of the show. No noise, etc. They are copied to DAT and then piped through usually SoundForge then to CDR.

Many SHN versions of shows have a great lineage: SBDDATSoundForgeCDR. Don't talk about things you don't know about, please.

SHN is very usefull for archives. It is also very usefull for listening to. Imagine you want to store your master copy of all your music on a hard drive in a computer along with the rest of your stero system. Now imagine you want to replicate audio CD's for friends (this is legal for all the bands that allow taping at concerts, phish allows you to distribute SHN's of their shows if they were taped by independant tapers) So you can listen to these SHN's on your stero, and if you want a MP3 CD for your car, you just run the shn's through a perl script, and now you have an MP3 cd of the same material. Now imagine a friend stops by with some CD-R's and wants to spin a few disks of the new shows you just downloaded off etree.

Just stick the blank in, and run it through a perl script, and boom, instant audio cd with no compression loss. MP3's are good for the end result, but for the source file, you dont want mp3, you want lossLESS.

And SHN will cut most wav's in half. Not only this, but data integrity of SHN's is much better than storing your master copy in an 'audio CD' because of the way the data is encoded onto the medium (audio cd's do not have as much redundancy on a disk, so a scratch will lose data, whereas, on a data disk you have redundant encoding on the media itself) For all these reasons, SHN is good for just about everything. Too bad my car MP3 disk player doesn't support SHN's. It's great that Phish has decided to make a lossless format available as well as the lossy mp3s.

etree.org has been doing this for a number of years, and a method of distribution has been developed that preserves the quality of the audio as it passes through many hands. Etree.org offers legal show recordings from bands that promote the taping of their shows. The bands get free publicity, the fans get free recordings - it works out for both parties. Phish is pretty typical in that they only allow audience recordings (no soundboard access) and they sell (generally) better sounding soundboard recordings. The Grateful Dead started legal concert taping years ago, eventually setting aside stageside sections for tapers where they could set up mic booms and their DAT recorders.

These concerts (plus those of Phish, Allman Bros, Dead satellite groups, etc) for the past five-six years have been available on etree.org which is essentially a clearinghouse for FTPs with.shn versions of these shows. Been downloading them for years. From the site: 'You can find nearly every band that allows taping in the jambands community on etree.org, including Phish, The Grateful Dead, The Seth Yacovone Band, String Cheese Incident, The Slip, Medeski, Martin & Wood, Umphrey's McGee, The Big Wu, Amfibian and The New Deal.' I would venture to say that these same Phish shows will be available on Etree sites, so why does livephish think people will pay for what they A) can get free already from Etree or B) will almost certainly end up on Etree anyway? Besides, doesn't charging for taped concerts kind of go against the concert-tapes-as-promotion philosophy? The reason the Dead were the most successful concert band of all time was partially due to the free availability of tons of concert tapes.

I know livephish has to pay for bandwidth, but this is a much larger divergence from the Dead/Phish philosophy of free concert music than people seem to believe. I would venture to say that these same Phish shows will be available on Etree sites, so why does livephish think people will pay for what they A) can get free already from Etree or B) will almost certainly end up on Etree anyway?.

Because I support the band. Because I like their music, and it's from the patch board, where the signal is nice and clean. Because we all been bitching and moaning about the DMCA and record companies, and this can prove to the bands that there are other ways to make money. Because I'm Karma Whoring, here and in the real world. Phish has charged for concert recordings for a number of years now, for example:. A Live One.

Hampton Comes Alive. The 'Live Phish' Series (currently at volume 16). Slip, Stitch, and Pass That's 19 live albums that they have sold. And they still allow taping their shows. Obviously, not everyone will buy shows off livephish, but some dedicated fans (like my room mate) who want to show support for them probably will. I tend not to second guess phish, as they are the most successful 'jam band' around; they seem to know what they are doing. This is totally in the Grateful Dead tradition of viral marketing.

The Dead let people tape and trade their shows, but you couldn't sell them. The traders developed a barter system, and soundboard copies of shows were top dog in the barter system. You could get 3-4 non-soundboard shows for one soundboard.

Phish.net: Help Finding .shn Player For Mac Pro

So now Phish will provide people with REALLY high quality bootlegs of shows for $10 (I guess bootleg isn't really the right term). People will buy them. And this puts MORE Phish music out there, and makes people more likely to go to their concerts and buy their studio releases - and that is the real goal.

They know people will copy and trade these shows for free - again - that is the goal. They just give anyone an easy way to get any concert for $10. That is a lot of value compared to checking bartering message boards and trying to come up with a valuable enough trade. A smart business move by Phish. The Dead made their shows tradeable, and had more concert attendance in the 1980s and 1990s than any other band.

They made a lot of cash from their shows, and from their merchandising. You're retarded.

You NEVER did more than a 1-1 trade. If you didn't have a SBD to trade back, you did a B&P (blanks and postage) trade or joined a vine (tape starts at one person and goes along down the list of people who then make their own copy from the master and pass it along - doesn't increase generations that way). Now that we have fast connections and CD burners there is no longer a need to trade. Large FTPs are setup to do the serving for several 'seeds' of good quality shows. People get them and burn them. If they see fit, they burn and send out for trades/B&P to those that are on 56k or are too lazy/uninformed to get it from etree. I don't think it is a smart business move.

I am even MORE inclined not to attend one of their concerts b/c of this. The Grateful Dead were one of the most successul bands w/o major album releases nor high ticket costs. They let you listen to them in their best setting (live) for free. I don't agree w/what Phish did. I'm sorry, but you have not given any good reasons about why this makes you mad, or less likely to go to a show. Phish has always allowed tapers to tape the show for free (in some cases, you need a special tapers ticket, but usually just buy a regular one and bring your equipment to the show) These recorded shows are legally distributeable for FREE.

The only restriction is that you are not allowed to sell them. Recently, Phish started selling live soundboard recordings of these same shows on CD. You can buy them at your local CD store, or off the phish website for about $20 US. All that is changing is that now, insted of waiting for these new volumes of live shows to be released, they are going to have every show available on their website, for a $13 US fee, and you bring your own media. Not only that, but now Phish is making $13 off each show they sell (minus cost), insted of $2 that their record label gives them. If you don't want to buy the $13 SHN's, then keep downloading the legal bootleg releases insted.

The quality is almost just as good, and its free, and freely distributeable. This will not put an end to bootleg trading, it will just give the people that want to support the band, and who want higher quality recordings, the opportunity to do so. (BTW, almost none of the officially released shows are freely distributeable, only the SHN's taped by independant tapers) These shows sold off livephish.com will NOT show up on etree. It is etree's policy to not serve any content that is not legally distributeable.

The etree community polices itself very well, and anybody who offered an FTP account containing illegal content will be removed from the list in a heartbeat. You're retarded. You NEVER did more than a 1-1 trade. If you didn't have a SBD to trade back, you did a B&P (blanks and postage) trade or joined a vine No, I never did. My brother, however, has several hundred dead shows on tape, and sometimes he would find something he wanted, and would have to spend several more trades to get whatever it was the person offering the item of interest wanted. That is all changing now, though, with the internet. Sound board copies of shows 10-15 years old are becoming REALLY common, whereas they used to be incredibly rare.

Anyway, to the point. Phish's move will increase the quality and quantity of their live concert performance tapings, and will make money doing it. If the Grateful Dead were right, this makes Phish money in concert attendance, in merchandising, and in sales of studio albums. And I think the GD were right, but time will tell.

Besides, doesn't charging for taped concerts kind of go against the concert-tapes-as-promotion philosophy? The reason the Dead were the most successful concert band of all time was partially due to the free availability of tons of concert tapes. I know livephish has to pay for bandwidth, but this is a much larger divergence from the Dead/Phish philosophy of free concert music than people seem to believe. A couple points: - Phish does not allow soundboard patches at their shows (due to the illegal foreign 'import' scene). These soundboard recordings will naturally sound better than your typical audience recording. I'll pay for the quality. Some of my audience recordings sound great.

Others sound like they were recorded in a tin can. You can still freely trade any audience tape/mp3/shn. In fact, Phish just modified their taping/trading policy to allow ANY audience recording to be traded online ( phish.com).

The previous policy prohibited the online trading of audience recordings if a commercial release of the same show was available. How is this any different from the live Grateful Dead releases (i.e. Dick's Picks)? You won't find any of the Dick's Picks releases on etree.org. Seems to me like they are embracing a new medium.

1st, Phish are Phish, not the Grateful Dead. But since the door has been opened, the Grateful Dead has a whole line of live recordings called the 'Dick's Picks' series, and I just bought one last weekend. 1) I wanted to support the band (or I guess GDM now) and my local record store 2) It was a killer show (11/1/85), and I know that Dick's Picks are about the best quality out there (although there are incredible recordings on Etree!

3) I could afford to buy the damned thing! I work for a living, and have downloaded lots of stuff for free, so why can't I pay for a recording that has been hand picked and professionally mastered, etc.

Regarding the 'honor system' and no DRM, etc. Isn't this what we have been doing in the past with music?

I don't think that Phish or any other band is being a bad guy for selling something that they have made. I do it every day at my job, don't you? Plus for 10/13 bucks a pop, that is not bad. You know that the server will not drop you, unlike Etree. Anyone who has done etree for a while knows what it feels like to have a couple songs missing from a show. Also, the GD tradition is to allow paying concert goers to freely tape and distribute those tapes, there is nothing that says they will tape and freely distribute their shows. Besides, doesn't charging for taped concerts kind of go against the concert-tapes-as-promotion philosophy?

The reason the Dead were the most successful concert band of all time was partially due to the free availability of tons of concert tapes. I know livephish has to pay for bandwidth, but this is a much larger divergence from the Dead/Phish philosophy of free concert music than people seem to believe. You're perfectly free to continue making and trading audience tapes. These downloads are the soundboards, which Phish is treating as commercial releases, just distributed through the internet instead of on physical CDs. Besides, the Dead did the same thing all along.

What do you think Live Dead, Europe 72, Steal Your Face, Without A Net, the Vault series, and Dick's Picks are? Commercial releases of live concert soundboard recordings. I would venture to say that these same Phish shows will be available on Etree sites, so why does livephish think people will pay for what they A) can get free already from Etree or B) will almost certainly end up on Etree anyway? A) Etree will have the audience tapes for free. Live Phish Downloads will have the soundboards for sale.

B) These recordings will NOT end up on Etree. These are commercial releases, which are off-limits for tape trading. I've been lucky enough to get out to see the coolest shows in this 'genre' this year. I think it's a cool thing they're doing even from the simple fact that it gives us a chance to test and find the business model that we like for dealing music on the web. With so many companies biting it. Liquid Audio for instance.

Some experimentation is in order. I'll tell you why I'll by directly from Phish online. Quality control. They're not going to release a poor quality recording on that site. It's going to be the best you can get. Why I never got into Etree. Professed.shn snobs are the primary reason.

Why on earth would I want to here all the lossless glory of a two Shure SM58 mics hooked up to a Sony minidisc player. (In other words some people. SOME people out there are not recording experts.) And in that case You're not going to get a feed that would sound good enough to merit a file size 10x larger. I would get into.shn if I knew the source of the audio was High quality (came straight from the band or a buddy who was a taper.). Instead of spending 500MB of downloading on what turned out to be crap. I can't wait to download NYC on New Years Eve after I get home from that show.

I speak for most people. I buy the CD's because studio recording and live performance are two entirely different arts. Both which should be appreciated. Live CD's I buy for the reason I'd download a confirmed high quality lossless recording. Quality of live recording.

And who else out there thought Bonnaroo rocked?!!! Lars' comment has long been taken out of context. His complaint was 'no one asked me if I want to participate', in reference to file trading online. Sure, Metallica allowed fans to trade music early on in their career, but METALLICA made this choice, not the fans. Something lost in this tiresome debate between the RIAA and geeks worldwide, too fucking cheap to buy a CD but spend ungodly amounts of money on computer gear, is what do the artists want?

Phish seems to want to let fans download their music online, with limitations of course. Does this mean every musician wants this? Does Phish speak for an entire industry? No, they do not. They merely speak for their own little band and their own little band doesn't mind a little file trading of their concerts. Many seem to think they can do whatever the fuck they want but let's spin this in a way many here can understand. What if I took some GPL'ed code and built a proprietary app with it.

Say, for instance, I took GIMP and made it usable by the print industry and fixed the horrible UI. Then I went to sell the application online and made millions on my new Photoshop killer and I refused to relinquish the source code despite the incessant whining of the geek community over violating their license. When you copy music you have done the exact same thing. You have violated a license, an agreement between you and the copyright holder. Phish allows for more lenient terms in licensing of their copyrights. Other bands aren't as amenable to these terms and stick with the standard copyright license as set forth in US and foreign law.

In my opinion, you have absolutely no fucking right to cry foul when your rights are being violated if you willfully violate the rights of others. I'm not sure about your parent's post about the 'license' but any time you recieve a work that is copyrighted, you are automatically bound by copyright law, without having to sign or agree to anything. All a license does is give you EXTRA rights aside from that already granted to you via copyright law (fair use). Under copyright law, if you recieve (because you paid for it, or obtained it in other legal ways) a work without any type of license, that means that you are 100% restricted to not redistribute the work. The only copies you are allowed are fair use copies, etc. If an EULA or license does not grant you extra rights, sometimes they do bad and RESTRICT those rights guaranteed to you by copyright law.

In these cases, those parts of the EULA are effectively unenforceable. No EULA can restrict fair use and be valid. So in a sence, your right, you didn't sign or accept any agreement when you purchased the work. On the other hand, you are not legally allowed to do anything except listen to it consistant to the fair use clause in US copyright law, and not copy it under any other circumstances. So you are in fact bound, but not by a contract, but by US Criminal law, wether you accept any extra agreements/EULA's or not.

In effect, the 'spirit' of your parent is correct, though it is technically incorrect. (straight from the FAQ. I found this, for some reason, quite amusing.) What are the recommended specs for enjoying Live Phish Downloads? Windows Windows 98SE, 2000, ME, XP, or later 128 MB RAM 10 GB Hard Drive (a larger hard drive is optimal) Pentium III 750MHz or faster (or equivalent) Cable Modem or DSL Internet Explorer 5.5 or later Mac OS Mac OS 9.1 or later 128 MB RAM 10GB Hard Drive (a larger hard drive is optimal) Cable Modem or DSL Internet Explorer 5 or later Unix You probably don't need our advice.

So now that phish is SELLING these recordings, is it still legal to download from furthur? The Phish concerts on furthur are for the most part audience recordings. It will remain perfectly legal to upload or download any audience recording from Furthur. Nothing changes there.

Consider these new downloaded soundboards as commercial releases. It's just as illegal to place these downloaded soundboards on Furthur as it would be to upload Phish's latest studio album. But Phish has no problem with you trading audience tapes of the same shows. Just not the soundboards that they are trying to sell. Simple enough! For over two years this band has been on hiatus, yet their 4 show holiday run may be some of the most difficult tickets to attain, ever. Why so much popularity for a very non-mainstream jam band?

The free distribution of live recordings of nearly every show they've played and the behind the scenes efforts of dedicated fans like david ihoz.com steinberg, paul glace at phantasytour.com and the crew at etree.org with their nearly anal quality hounds tracking the the recording status and quality of most legally traded music on the internet. Live distribution shows what a dynamic band this really is.

Not a cookie cutter, same show every night type band! Check them out. This story upsets me. For years, I've been a Dave Matthews Band fan, another band which allows live taping of their shows. One of the great things about live taping is the community that gets built around the band, without the band being directly involved. I've met so many great people through trades and message boards.

Since the policy states that copies can't be made for other people, the entire network of live performance trading (for Phish, anyways), has just been destroyed, and the community that the trading has created with it. I hope the band enjoys their $10 or $13, but it may cost them fans in the long run, and I hope it does. This is not a good precedent to set. Should DMB ever go this way with their taping policy, I guarantee that they won't see another dime from me.

Live performances is what first excited me about DMB, and the grassroots support that they had (and still do) via the trading network is a beutiful thing, and should be preserves. Yes, even in the face of the almighty dollar.

You know, this whole debate has been framed around the recording industry losing consumers but maybe there's an even bigger issue out there. What if the RIAA starts losing artists?

And I'm not talking about existing artists wedded to the RIAA system. What is the recording industry going to do when an entire generation of artists who won't even remember the day when a piece of information had to be married to an object (when the music had to come in the form of something physical like a CD) decide to distribute their own recordings online? I'm not saying that this will definitely happen. If future DRM devices disallows us from playing any 'unsigned' material, it won't happen. If artists can't find effective formulas for rising above the internet din, they won't try it. And there will always be artists who are hooked on the label system and their dope of MTV fame, the bling-bling, and the rockstar lifestyle. But most artists don't get signed anyway.

Major media is the distribution lotto. One of the reasons people play the lotto is if they're desperate and have very little other chance of making an honest living.

Net distribution might offer a chance to make an honest living. If more artists look at it this way, maybe they'll decide to distribute themselves. When high profile artists decide to self-distribute, it must drive the RIAA nuts. Granted, Phish is distributing their soundboard recordings which only Elektra (their label) cares about, but if more major artists start pulling a Prince (escape the label, distribute through the web) and do it successfully, unsigned artists will follow. All hope lie in the proles!:). You know, I've looked around for awhile on etree and related sites, and the reason that I've never really gotten into them is a real lack of music that I want to hear (which is ok, for the most part).

I don't expect every music site to cater to my tastes. What's disturbing, however, is the fact that there is a supreme lack of (ie, none whatsoever) punk bands and bootlegs from punk concerts. You'd think that punk would have really adopted the whole linux/free software movement, given that the same 'fight the establishment'/DIY sentiment is really prevalent in both movements. I really wonder why more smaller punk bands don't put themselves up on sites like this now.

Crass used to bootleg themselves all the time, and they were selling halfway decent bootlegs of themselves for the mere cost of the tape years ago. Yes, I know that I probably shouldn't expect this from anyone on epitaph or fat records, or that whole wave of warped-tour style punk that most people tend to group everyone into. However, I really wish that punks would get with the program here and start using the net to spread their music and message more effectively.

Just my little rant.:/. They call this value. Phish is using a marketing philosophy that literally goes back to the beginning of time: Treat your customers with respect and they'll contine to be your customers. See, despite what Hilary Rosen would have you believe, music fans WANT to support musicians.

See, people make music for the following reasons (in order): 1. Because they love to. Because they love others to enjoy their music. And finally, 3 To make a living. This is why there's so many garage bands; most of them are happy to make a few bucks playing a wedding, and they have real jobs during the week.like writing code for example. Phish realizes this and says to their fans: for short money we'll give you honest VALUE.

Putting it simply, they treat their fans (customers) with respect. Also, consider that most of the 10 bucks you pay goes straight to Phish. Everybody wins.well almost everybody. The music INDUSTRY doesn't win. But remember, they don't make music all they do is distribute it. Their motivation is ONLY #3: to make money. Also, they don't respect their customers.

In fact, they publically call their customers THIEVES. Is it no wonder that nobody likes them back? See, despite what Hilary Rosen would have you believe, music fans WANT to support musicians. A lot of music 'fans' want whatever is cool at the moment, regardless of quality, tied to a carefully marketed star. Until that star becomes uncool (ie.

Not the latest and most heavily played), and suddenly all their former 'fans' are talking trash and pretending they never cared much for them. Refer to file labeled 'Spice Girls'.

Groups like this can't market music the same way Phish (or any other truly good band) does, simply because Phish has nurtured a community for years, and their live shows are unique works of art which lend themselves to the bootleg scene. Phish's fans will be glad to pay a few bucks for a good live recording, they respect the band and know the band respects them. Oh the irony. The music industry is so hooked on the fast heavy cash generated by the Britneys and P.

Diddy's they hype, that they've effectively generated a fan base who care nothing for the shallow music they consume, and thus feel little guilt about 'stealing intellectual property'. Ah, Hilary, live and learn. arguably these people are barely 'musicians', definitely not 'Artists' and can legitimately be called 'performers'.

Ok, obviously tastes vary, and if you don't like this band, paying for their music doesn't make sense. Having said this: this is exactly the way to escape RIA - you have to find musicians which will sell you their music without infringing on you fair-use rights.

I don't think it's ok to just 'share' mainstream music. If we don't like the terms the music industry offers, we should look around and find other bands who are.willing. to offer their music in reasonable formats, and then pay them appropriately. This might have the side effect of more variety returning to music, instead of having some cartell deciding which music we are supposed.

Ok, sorry for the rant, but how about slashdot providing some 'music review' section to complement the book reviews? The reviews would have to be about new artists, who are willing to sell mp3s (or some format like that) of their music. Just my 0.02 Euros. As someone who has listened to and taped phish over the years, this is fantastic news. phataudio.org was orginally a jamband MP3 site way back in the day before bandwidth costs got too high and P2P came out.

Other artists should take note that all Phish did was listen to the needs of their community! The Shn format is not very popular, but amongst the taping community it is thanks to etree.org.

It will be very interesting to see how this service affects their live taping policy. Phish's live taping policy is much more restrictive than most because they do not offer soundboard patches. Tapers are forced to use expensive mic and preamp rigs ($5000+) if they want to get anything close to soundboard sound. Live concert taping with microphones is part art, part science, and there are quite a few people who take it way too seriously. The other major restriction of the Phish taping policy is once they release an album of a concert, that concert cannot be distributed online.

I would imagine this service will not qualify as an 'album.' The next big step for this service will be the distribution of the Phish archives, Phish has recorded every concert from about 1990 on, possibly even earlier. Most of the recordings are multitrack DAT with audience mics to capture the crowd sounds. I would imagine the Grateful Dead will seek to duplicate this model if it is successful. A few years from now we might have every Grateful Dead and Phish show online, remastered SBD recordings. Today is a happy day for jamband fans. A little message to the authors of the 'Phish sucks' posts, stick to Creed.

Let me preface this by saying that I know next to nothing about this band, but did anybody catch nytimes.com last week? It makes this Phish fans sound like addicted cult members.

What struck me particularly odd was this quote: 'The band takes over a crowd,' said Megan Leff, 28, who works in advertising in Manhattan. 'They throw everyone into a fury. You cannot move or shake quickly enough. Then, suddenly, they will have everyone fall and pretend they are dead.'

Does this article conform with anybody's experiences with this band or is it just a hoakey sensationalistic headlining? Richard Thompson has been selling unavailable-anywhere live material, sold directly by the artist either mail order or at shows. It's not downloads, but its not copy-protected CDs, either. They're actually 'professional quality' CDs with real liner notes, photos and a quality production job. Unfortunately they're not whole shows, but 'best of' of specific tours. If I was a performed, I'd be inclined to do something like this.

I'd discourage taping at the show, but I'd sell every show I did in a complete a format as was possible with as good a quality of audio as was possible. My guess is that most artists (other than Titney and other fake entertainment industry creations) could do this and make money. Real fans would likely buy them at the right price - guaranteed quality, decent liner notes, support-my-artist mentality. As long as the sales cover the major up-front production cost, they should even make a buck on it, since the sound system and the show are pretty much paid for by the tickets to the show to begin with. Electronic distribution greatly lowers their upfront cost, but limits to some the value due to lack of liner notes, silkscreened CDs, etc, but would make selling every show more financially viable. Lots of bands sound 'crappy' live compared to the polished studio music I can't believe this got modded up as Informative. What you said is true, but Phish is definitely NOT one of these bands.

Phish has gotten its reputation by performing excellent live shows. I understand that you are saying that here is more to a Phish show than the music (the people, the parking lot scene, the drugs, etc.) and you are right.

But the music is what holds the entire scene together. Phish has a free live show available for download on phishlive.com.

Go and listen to it and get a taste of what Phish really sounds like. The slot they played on SNL runs almost directly counter to the spirit of the whole band. They are given one (or maybe two) pop-song-length bits of time to cram songs into.these are songs that routinely run over the five (and often ten) minute mark at real shows. And instead of being surrounded by tens of thousands of fans who know the music and can kick back and boogie, they have a barricade of TV lights glaring down on them. So, judge them if you want, but don't think you got anything close the real phish experience. Because some people don't have the bandwidth or disk space to spare on something that's 5 times bigger and offers a marginal increase in quality. I care a lot about the quality of the music I listen to, and I'm unable to tell the difference of a 160k+ MP3 and uncompressed audio.

Try it yourself and see if you can. The thing that really makes me giggle like a girl are the SHN freaks who offer terrible-quality audience recordings with a million warnings in capital letters telling you that if you ever so much as think about encoding the music into MP3 form, that your first born will be sacrificed.

Nicely written. A nice corraLarry;-) of this is that if you want, you can trade SHN's, but encode to mp3 or OGG for your own personal use. The main thing you want to consider is that you should NEVER distribute an MP3 for the purpose of a 'trade' (which implies that you are getting origional source). Especially if you are trading with people that have no earthly idea of the underlying issues. The biggest problem I have come across is people downloading mp3's, and then converting them to Audio CD's and trading them. This is wrong on so many levels, yet stupid people do it all the time not even realizing what problems they are adding to the community. As long as nobody converts MP3's/OGG's to audio CD's or SHN or WAV, we are all going to be doing just fine.

On the other hand, MP3 distribution is very very usefull if done properly. As long as you are downloading an MP3 knowing you dont have the origional, your goal should be to have a fast download, and something to listen to, but not a master copy. For instance, what if someone's only means to listen to music is via their car MP3 player, or their PC, and they don't plan on converting them to WAV or SHN or CD Audio, then by all means, download the mp3 if it makes you happier. Well, it's free as in beer, and nonrestrictive. If you really feel strongly about the matter, you could easily extract the SHNs into WAVs, then reencode them as FLACs.

Since all three are lossless formats, you wouldn't lose anything. Personally, I have no plans to do so. I'm assuming that Live Phish Downloads is licensing the SHN codec for commercial use. SoftSound did the taping community a huge favor by providing a free, unencumbered version of shorten for tape trading.

I have no problem with them making a little money now that their format has caught on. How does Live Phish Downloads affect your taping policy? For the most part, our taping policy remains unchanged. As with other official Phish releases, you may not copy (except for personal use) or trade files offered through Live Phish Downloads. We have made one significant change to the Policy that bears noting. The Policy now allows for audience recordings of any show to be traded person to person or through online repositories, whereas previously it was forbidden to offer audience recordings of shows that had been officially released through online repositories.

This change applies to live shows released on CD as well as via download The provision you disliked has been removed. In other words, the result of Live Phish is that Phish changed their taping policies to be LESS restrictive. I can't imagine anyone having a problem with that. By the time they signed with Elektra in 1992, Phish was an established band that was selling out concert halls on a regular basis. Phish had been chased by record labels for years, but the band held out, preferring to retain control over their copyrights, business rights, and creative decisions.

This allowed them to get a fantastic deal when they finally did sign with a label. Phish's contract with Elektra is a promotion and distribution contract, not a recording contract. Phish retained their copyrights, their internet rights, and their electronic distribution rights.

They retained complete creative control over their music and organization. Their relationship to Elektra is basically this.

They provide master tapes, and Elektra distributes and promotes the album. You can't get that sort of contract unless you're already a big name band. If Phish had signed with a RIAA corporation back when they were a brand new band, they would not be in a position to do what they are doing now. The record label would own their copyrights, their website, and their electronic distribution rights. Compare this system to the pathetic efforts of the RIAA to foist copy protected CDs and DRM-saturated, inferior MP3s on the public, and call that the 'future' of internet music distribution. By contrast, Phish is selling downloads of CD quality (SHN) recordings, with no DRM at all. You can download the CDs within two days of the concert.

You can also download CD art. Even better, once you have paid for a recording, the system remembers that you have done so in the 'My Stash' section.

If you ever lose or damage your CD, you can go back to the web site and re-download the shows you lost! I really can't imagine the system being any more customer-friendly, except if it was a bit cheaper. But the system is new, so I won't begrudge them that. Right now, the music industry is trying to establish the Big Lie - that music can't be distributed, especially online, unless the system is designed to treat every customer as a criminal. The music must be laden with obstructive DRM. Users must be prevented from making backups.

Live Phish Downloads has the potential to be the Big Counterexample. Phish said it themselves - this is all about the honor system. You respect us, and we respect you. In the end, that's how copyright was designed to work in the first place. The whole idea of copyright being a war between record labels and their customers is a relatively new concept, and this is a nice beginning to putting an end to it.

Gobble Gobble Mystery Jammers, back at the controls for a moment to mess with you before sending you off deep into the to get all the discounts ($7? Did I forget to mention – forget to mention: Welcome to the 353rd edition of the MJM, home of Phish nerds, and the ancient art of jam recognition? (No, this isn't a 'Cities'-themed MJM.) The winner will receive an MP3 download code courtesy of our friends at /. To win, be the first person to identify the songs and dates of the three mystery clips. These three clips are connected by a theme, but the theme needn't be part of the correct answer.

Each person gets one guess to start – if no one answers correctly in the first 24 hours, a hint will be posted. After the hint, everyone gets one more guess before Wednesday at 10 AM PT / 1 PM ET. Good luck You'll need it. Hint: It's three versions of the same song, about three years apart from one another (though the clips are not necessarily in chronological order).

I thought for sure someone reading the forum yesterday would've figured this one out by now. Answer: For the sixth time this year, the Blog has the pleasure of crowning another MJM Emeritus. Burst onto the MJM scene in April 2018 with, and proceeded to go on one of the fastest sprints to seven wins we've ever seen, including winning five MJMs between MJM340 and MJM347 alone. After a five week dry spell – an eternity for – he solved the most difficult MJM of the year (with a generous hint, to be fair) to finally reach the promised land. This week, he catapulted across the finish line by identifying the and For his efforts, in addition to the standard key card to The Vault from Kevin Shapiro and addition to the massive group text with the band (Mike's emoji game on fleek), receives a copy of the new Baker's Dozen remastered box set on 56 8 track tapes presented in a carboard box Fishman tucked for all three Gorge shows this summer, a copy of the soundcheck 'Turbidity Jam' (with Mike on plunger), a that doubles as a one-way ticket to the, and most importantly, an open invitation to stump the MJM regulars at this beautiful game. Congratulations My Friend, My Friend – you'll always remember where you were when you were elected into the MJM Hall of Fame. Stay tuned for MJM354 on Monday, when wumbo returns for an easy single clipper.

Welcome to the 352nd edition of Phish.Net's Mystery Jam Monday, the third of November. The winner will receive an MP3 download code courtesy of our friends at /. To win, be the first person to identify the songs and dates of the two mystery clips. Each person gets one guess to start – if no one answers correctly in the first 24 hours, a hint will be posted. After the hint, everyone gets one more guess before Wednesday at 10 AM PT / 1 PM ET.

Good luck Answer: Congrats to, who gave the blog less than an hour to fantasze about using to describe how Horn-y this puzzle is: and In doing so, he continues his meteoric rise onto the MJM scene with his third win, all in 2018. Speaking of 2018, we've only got a handful MJMs left the year, so stop by Monday for when the blog guarantees.

the difficult puzzle lasts more than fitty-five minutes.guarantees not guaranteed. Welcome to the 351st edition of Phish.Net's Mystery Jam Monday, the second of November. The winner will receive an MP3 download code courtesy of our friends at /. To win, be the first person to identify the songs and dates of the two mystery clips. Each person gets one guess to start – if no one answers correctly in the first 24 hours, a hint will be posted. After the hint, everyone gets one more guess before Wednesday at 10 AM PT / 1 PM ET. Good luck Answer: After a whopping six and a half years, pulls out his third win, now on track to reach emeritus status by 2030!

#MiguelSanchezForEmeritus2030 - I'm pulling for ya, dude. In rather short time he sniffed out the theme of NYE '17, with the featured jams of choice being the and; both have been getting lots of spin on my end in preparation for the upcoming NYE run. I invite all of you to join next week, where has helped to concoct a tough but solvable MJM. Welcome to the 350th edition of Phish.Net's Mystery Jam Monday, the first and easiest of November.

The winner will receive an MP3 download code courtesy of our friends at /. To win, be the first person to identify the song and date of the mystery clip. Each person gets one guess to start – if no one answers correctly in the first 24 hours, a hint will be posted. After the hint, everyone gets one more guess before Wednesday at 10 AM PT / 1 PM ET. Good luck Reminder: For the first MJM of each month, only folks who have never won an MJM are allowed to answer before the hint.

If you have never won an MJM, please answer as a blog comment below. If you have previously won an MJM, but you'd like to submit a guess before the hint, you may do so by; once the hint has been posted, everyone should answer on the blog. If that's confusing to you, check out the that threw together to help guide you. If you're not sure if you've won before, check in the linked below.

Hint: A real-time look into how this clip was selected, at the time of its performance., mouth agape: 'Dude, this would make a dope MJM!' Me, turning to: 'I was just thinking the exact same thing hah!' : 'Good thing you're taping tonight, let's use your recording!' Answer: No, this MJM was not a giant crustacean from the Paleolithic era. Quite the opposite, in fact - this jam was a young 'un, the. As the hint suggests I had the good fortune to catch this show with. We may have gotten our rage on that evening, but more importantly wins his very first MJM code!

Will he be a one-hit wonder, or will he now enter the fray as a new challenger on a path to the promised land of emeriti? Stay tuned next week to find out! Another Las Vegas Phish run is in the books and with its successful conclusion, draws to a close. Is everybody ready to be spoon fed some perception? Long time readers of my recaps will know to either or start limbering up your fingers so they are ready to tap out some “Shade” about how you don’t want to know what I think about while listening to Phish work their magic, because you are just here to find out what happened during the show. In the simplest terms possible THEY CRUSHED IT.again.have a nice day!

© 2018 Phish (Rene Huemer). The all-volunteer, fan-run is once again celebrating Phish tour by making unsolicited Tour Grants supporting a music program near each of the venues at which the band will perform. In honor of Phish's upcoming shows at MGM Grand Garden Arena, October and November, and, we have sent a check for $2500 to in Las Vegas, NV. Mockingbird has now made 385 grants, covering all 50 states, and totalling more than $1.3M. Watch for news posts here at Phish.net, or the evolving at mbird.org, for news on other 'miracle' tour grants this fall. And please consider making a, to help us give back to the communities we've touched. The all-volunteer, fan-run is once again celebrating Phish tour by making unsolicited Tour Grants supporting a music program near each of the venues at which the band will perform.

In honor of Phish's upcoming shows at Allstate Arena on October, and, we have sent a check for $2500 to in Rosemont, IL. Mockingbird has now made 384 grants, covering all 50 states, and totalling more than $1.3M. Watch for news posts here at Phish.net, or the evolving at mbird.org, for news on other 'miracle' tour grants this fall. And please consider making a, to help us give back to the communities we've touched.

The all-volunteer, fan-run is once again celebrating Phish tour by making unsolicited Tour Grants supporting a music program near each of the venues at which the band will perform. In honor of Phish's upcoming shows at Ascend Amphitheater on October and, we have sent a check for $2500 to in Nashville, TN. Watch for news posts here at Phish.net, or the evolving at mbird.org, for news on other 'miracle' tour grants this fall. And please consider making a, to help us give back to the communities we've touched. The all-volunteer, fan-run is once again celebrating Phish tour by making unsolicited Tour Grants supporting a music program near each of the venues at which the band will perform. In honor of Phish's shows at Hampton Coliseum, on October, and in Hampton, VA, we've sent a check for $2,500 to the band and chorus at, part of.

Watch for news posts here at Phish.net, or the evolving at mbird.org, for news on other 'miracle' tour grants this fall. And please consider making a, to help us give back to the communities we've touched. The all-volunteer, fan-run is once again celebrating Phish tour by making unsolicited Tour Grants supporting a music program near each of the venues at which the band will perform.

In honor of Phish's shows at Times Union Center, and in Albany, NY, we've sent a check for $2,500 to, the longest-running inner city independent alternative school in the country. Watch for news posts here at Phish.net, or the evolving at mbird.org, for news on other 'miracle' tour grants this fall. And please consider making a, to help us give back to the communities we've touched. The all-volunteer, fan-run is once again celebrating Phish tour by making unsolicited 'miracle' tour grants supporting a music program near each of the venues the band will play. To celebrate Phish's upcoming three shows at Dick's in Commerce City, CO (which start ), we've sent a $1,500 check to the.

The total of $16,500 in grants is part of a to help bring music from the Phish community to the local community, and are one of many ways fans contribute to the areas in which the band performs. Mockingbird has now made $125,000 in tour grants, 10% of made. Check out the evolving at mbird.org for news on other 'miracle' tour grants this summer. And please consider making a, to help us give back to the communities we've touched.

There are still spaces left in the, a charity golf tournament for Phish fans, September 1st at Applewood Golf Course in Denver - but time's running out, and we need to finalize the roster. A donation of $125 (such as to paypal@mbird.org) covers greens fees, practice balls, cart fees, a small boxed lunch, a limited-edition event cooler (plus more limited-edition event goodies inside), and a nominal donation to support music education for children.

Plus, four players will each win $170 in Merrell Money, for fantastic shoes! Don't fret about rusty playing.

This is good times swinging clubs with fellow phans, for a good cause, and all smiles. See you there!